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#1 2007-08-10 21:38:20

Kevin
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The Opposite

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"It's time to NUT UP, or SHUT UP!"  --  Tallahassee

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#2 2007-08-10 21:44:09

Gatornation
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Re: The Opposite

The Opposite, well its a tough position to play in volleyball, you have to hit "Red's and "5's" Luckily you don't have to pass, but the defence on the Right Side sucks, anyway setter is a much better position


TFFG League 2    1 QB, 2 WR, 1 RB, 1 TE, 1RB,WR,TE Flex, 1 K, 1 D
QB Palmer/McNair
RB Alexander/Maroney/BarberIII/Morency/Droughnes
WR Driver/Chambers/Galloway/Hackett/Jenkins  TE Davis/McMicheal

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#3 2007-08-10 21:44:51

Kevin
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Re: The Opposite

For those of you that come to the forums first, new article on the homepage ...


"It's time to NUT UP, or SHUT UP!"  --  Tallahassee

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#4 2007-08-10 22:09:03

ninjajakem
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Re: The Opposite

Its certainly an interesting strategy, I have never tried it but theres no time like the present. So lets say you go QB WR TE WR then look for RBs, you need atleast one that is the solid starter (Jamal Lewis? or as Gator calls him, Jewis) and there are a lot of question marks at that point. Norwood, Adrian peterson, Marshawn lynch, fred taylor and kevin jones are all RBs you will get there.

Also, an unrelated note, you should add the ability to comment on the article to the homepage OR just post the entire text of the article into your forum post.


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#5 2007-08-10 22:27:31

Oakfaire Assassins
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Re: The Opposite

well.... I might be your man for this one...... I did this last year with great results and was going to do it again this year until I made a trade for first pick overall in a 14 player league. 

Last year we had 16 players and I drafted like this:

WR-Chad Johnson
WR-Larry Fitzgerald
QB-Carson Palmer, no one wanted him due to injury from year before
TE-Tony Gonzalez, A Gates was gone
RB-Cedric Benson, thought he was going to be starter from pre-season hype
RB-Joseph Addai, bunch of groans as others were going to pick him
RB-Ahman Green, no one wanted to touch him due to injury history
DEF-Chicago
K-Stover and Wilkins, ended up letting Wilkins go.. oops.
WR-Greg Jennings

then picked up sleepers and players who I thought had a chance including Marques Colston and Devery Henderson, played musical backs with Houston and Jets and never did pick the right ones, or released one to have him start the next week, no more committee teams for me.

I made it to the championship game and lost, but I did not have consistancy thorughout the season.  Chad Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald hurt me at times, as well as Carson Palmer several weeks.  I set the all time record for highest points scored when Carson and Chad blew up that one week... but that means nothing if you don't get the trophy in the end.


QB-Schaub RB- Gore,Mathews,Stewart,Foster,M BushK- Carpenter DST- Mia WR-Nicks,Wallace,Knox,DBryant TE- Miller  season record:0-0 Start: 1QB,2RB,2WR,1RB/WR,1TE,1K,1DST

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#6 2007-08-10 23:41:32

Dave
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Registered: 2007-06-26
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Re: The Opposite

It's a strange concept but the teams you put together in your article (especially the second one) weren't awful by any means. I guess the strategy may have some promise in leagues where you expect that everyone will use the same draft strategy as you (like in the TFFG leagues) and may have similar rankings. In that case, all you're doing is pitting the same draft strategy against one another and your chances of winning the championship are about 1 in 12 depending on your lineup adjustments, waivers, etc. Using a completely different strategy may actually pan out since the RB pool would be so diluted for everyone else. I can't bring myself to actually use this strategy in a money league, but after your article I probably won't heckle someone who does...  Well, not as much.

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#7 2007-08-10 23:52:10

BrianLion
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Re: The Opposite

interesting. were this to work this would be earth-shattering...like when Homer Simpson disproved the existence of God... smile


You asked for a hero. You didn't say anything about sanity.

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#8 2007-08-10 23:59:07

Baltimore Mike
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Re: The Opposite

Last year I put that theory to the test, even though I wasn't trying to.

My picks went:
Manning, Fitzgerald, Gates, Benson, D. Foster.

I was hurting all year, and the only chance I had was that I was able to pick up Deuce in the 7th round which gave me a fighting chance. It taught me a lesson; don't wait until the 4th to pick up a back. If someone wants to get Manning in the first I can't really fault them, one year that guy carried people's teams, and he's been a beast, but your next pick better be a back. True your second team didn't look half bad, but you are just gambling on unsure backs. Like in poker, do you want to go all in with pocket aces, or take your chances on a smaller hand hoping that it plays out the way you need it to.


"This is America, the alleged land of free speech."
~ Kevin Moore

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#9 2007-08-11 01:09:25

Gatornation
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Re: The Opposite

The thing is is that most people in the TFFG leagues will take Lyles strategy, opening up big holes for the opposite strategy, i hope to use a hybrid version inbetween the two in most leagues getting a QB early so i don't have to waste a pick on a good backup QB


TFFG League 2    1 QB, 2 WR, 1 RB, 1 TE, 1RB,WR,TE Flex, 1 K, 1 D
QB Palmer/McNair
RB Alexander/Maroney/BarberIII/Morency/Droughnes
WR Driver/Chambers/Galloway/Hackett/Jenkins  TE Davis/McMicheal

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#10 2007-08-11 01:53:16

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

Wouldn't a TRUE opposite draft also include a high pick for a defense (CHI or BALT) and kicker?


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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#11 2007-08-11 02:27:21

Gatornation
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Re: The Opposite

jetskifreak82 wrote:

Wouldn't a TRUE opposite draft also include a high pick for a defense (CHI or BALT) and kicker?

He's trying to have a different draft strategy, not throw away his team


TFFG League 2    1 QB, 2 WR, 1 RB, 1 TE, 1RB,WR,TE Flex, 1 K, 1 D
QB Palmer/McNair
RB Alexander/Maroney/BarberIII/Morency/Droughnes
WR Driver/Chambers/Galloway/Hackett/Jenkins  TE Davis/McMicheal

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#12 2007-08-11 02:51:35

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

Well I'm not saying too high, but I'm saying why not try doing what some people do, like take Ravens in the 6th and Vinitieri in the 10th.


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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#13 2007-08-11 03:56:37

davecat
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Re: The Opposite

Here is my version - this is really all about the initial 4-5 picks as people tend to scatter with their strategy after that. I like this team. All I need is one of the Jackson to hit.

(picking 7th)

** (7) Team Rubi - Peyton Manning QB
** (14) Team Rubi - Marvin Harrison WR
** (27) Team Rubi - Terrell Owens WR
** (34) Team Rubi - Brandon Jacobs RB
** (47) Team Rubi - T.J. Houshmandzadeh WR
** (54) Team Rubi - Jamal Lewis RB
** (67) Team Rubi - Bears D/ST D/ST
** (74) Team Rubi - Chris Cooley TE
** (87) Team Rubi - Brandon Jackson RB
** (94) Team Rubi - Vincent Jackson WR
** (107) Team Rubi - Michael Turner RB
** (114) Team Rubi - Chris Brown RB
** (127) Team Rubi - Joe Horn WR
** (134) Team Rubi - Brett Favre QB
** (147) Team Rubi - Brandon Jones WR
** (154) Team Rubi - Robbie Gould K

Last edited by davecat (2007-08-11 11:48:25)


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#14 2007-08-11 06:39:51

Hardss
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Re: The Opposite

BrianLion wrote:

interesting. were this to work this would be earth-shattering...like when Homer Simpson disproved the existence of God... smile

Save me jebus smile

Good article Kev, an intresting way to look at things.


I finally won a championship last year. Even if i go badly this year, let's talk about last year!!!!!!

"There are no stupid questions, only stupid people"

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#15 2007-08-11 09:02:56

Jeff O
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Re: The Opposite

The true key is t understand how the other members in your league will draft.

In my league I knew that most of the guys did not have much expirence so I decided to draft heavy at running back and then go from there. It hurt me at WR but I had enough depth to trade a top RB for a top WR mid-season and went on to win.

In the TFFG's league, I knew that everyone was a gamer and that the strategy was to go RB first in order to not be left behind.

With that in mind you need create a draft strategy that is tailored to the type of league yu are in, the level of player you are going against and draft position.


-J-

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#16 2007-08-11 16:48:42

Beaudog
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Re: The Opposite

I think it COULD work if the situation was just right.  And by just right, I mean damn near perfect.

If everyone in your league was the type that would "follow" your picks and maintain a run in the position you're drafting, I think this could actually work really well.  I unfortunately do not play in such a league and would get eaten alive.


"I want to rush for 1,000 or 1,500 yards, whichever comes first."
-New Orleans Saint RB George Rogers

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#17 2007-08-11 22:13:13

kilgoretrout
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Re: The Opposite

A guy on our league did the opposite last year.  Here was his main core of his team as drafted per round with the 9th pick of 11 owner:

1. Chad Johnson
2. Steve Smith
3. Donald Driver
4. Kevin Jones
5. Fred Taylor
6. Tony Gonzales
7. Chester Taylor

Anyways, he was really struggling by the midway point cause he didn't have a serviceable pair of RB's.  Chester started off hot and so did Fred.  But MJD took over and Chester wore down.  Jones obviously struggled.  Johnson and Smith were up and down.  He did trade off his QB (I think he had Bulger, for Colston and Kitna).  The other owners really wanted Smith or Johnson from him, but when you looked at the RB's out there, they weren't worth giving up.  He ended up 8-5, but lost handily in the first round of the playoffs. 

It goes to show that a good core of RB's is what it takes.  I've never heard an owner say after winning the championship, "Boy, sure glad I had Smith and Ocho Cinco".  But I always here the champion say something like "Boy, [insert LT, SJ, or LJ] was a monster all season and [insert Westbrook, Gore, or MJG] was a steal!   Without them I would have lost to Team 3.  I'm also glad that I had [insert 12th best WR] and [insert 20th best WR].  They helped seal it, but the [insert RB names] were awesome!!!  Thanks for you money chumps!!!"


$$Money League Team$$  Start: 1QB, 2RB, 3WR, 1RB/WR Flex, 1 TE, 1K, 1D    (0-0)
QB E Manning RB D Williams, Spiller, Bradshaw, LT, B Scott, K Huggins
WR C Johnson, D Jackson, M Floyd, R Meachem, D McCluster, James Jones, H Douglas
TE O Daniels  K Prater  D NY Giants

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#18 2007-08-11 23:13:15

VoteForPedro
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From: Boston, MA / Hoboken, NJ
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Re: The Opposite

jetskifreak82 wrote:

Wouldn't a TRUE opposite draft also include a high pick for a defense (CHI or BALT) and kicker?

My dad took Adam Vinatieri in Round 3 of our draft last year. If that's not "the opposite" of the recommended draft strategy, I don't know what is.

(In my dad's defense, it was an auto-draft and his first year playing FFL, but clearly he didn't understand the league's scoring system. Case in point, he also had Peyton ranked #1 overall and ended up getting him with the #2 pick. He finished 5-8-1, tied for last place. To quote John Connor in T2, "Easy money.")


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#19 2007-08-12 01:33:51

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

So I wanted to try Kevin's theory, so I drafted first using "the formula" (or what I think Lyle is going to suggest as the formula), and the 2nd time I drafted the opposite. Both were done on ESPN mockdraft, and only 1 team left before round 15 in both drafts. 10 team leagues.

THE FORMULA DRAFT (Picking 4th, round taken in parenthases)
QB's: Romo (8), Kitna (9)
RB's: Addai (1), Portis (3), Jacobs (4) A. Peterson (7) R. Droughns (11)
WR's: Smith (2), Evans (5), R. Brown (6), V. Jackson (10), Jurevicius (14)
TE's: Witten (12), Dallas Clark (16)
DEF: Jags (13)
K: Graham (15)

THE OPPOSITE (pick 3, round in parenthases)
QB's: Manning (1), Rivers (10)
RB's: Norwood (4), J. Lewis (5), Foster (9), L. White (11), A. Thomas (15), M. Pittman (16)
WR's: Johnson (2), Holt (3), Cotchery (7), Jennings (12), Henderson (13)
TE: Gonzalez (6)
DEF: Chargers (8)
K: Wilkins (14)

So which of those two teams would you prefer to have?


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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#20 2007-08-12 08:19:13

drewseabass
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Re: The Opposite

Norwood couldn't have been the best RB on the board...I have him below Lewis, who you took in the 5th!


TEAM 1 (12 tm): QB Ryan, Cutler, Stafford. RB C Johnson, McCoy, R Brown, Jacobs, Ringer. WR Wayne, Bowe, S Moss, Royal, M Thomas, Naanee.  TE Witten, Z Miller (OAK). K Bueller. DST Miami.
TEAM 2 (10): QB Brady, D Anderson. RB MJD, Grant, Charles, A Foster, McFadden, D Brown. WR Fitzgerald, Crabtree, Floyd, Walter, J Jones. TE Z Miller K Rackers D Saints.

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#21 2007-08-12 14:06:12

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

Well I have to explain that pick. Norwood and Lewis were the only two decent RB's left, and ESPN has norwood pre-ranked like 10 spots higher than Lewis. The only guy not there was right after me, and Norwood was the highest pre-ranked player left, so I knew I wouldn't get him on the way back around. I hope that makes sense Drew.


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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#22 2007-08-12 14:21:58

drewseabass
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Re: The Opposite

Ugh...you used ESPN's rankings...so sorry!  Caddy was gone?  DeAngelo Williams even?  There HAD to be someone better than Norwood in the 4th...if not, it means there were stud WRs were still on the board there. 

I might have to give this strategy a try in a mock for myself and post the results...


TEAM 1 (12 tm): QB Ryan, Cutler, Stafford. RB C Johnson, McCoy, R Brown, Jacobs, Ringer. WR Wayne, Bowe, S Moss, Royal, M Thomas, Naanee.  TE Witten, Z Miller (OAK). K Bueller. DST Miami.
TEAM 2 (10): QB Brady, D Anderson. RB MJD, Grant, Charles, A Foster, McFadden, D Brown. WR Fitzgerald, Crabtree, Floyd, Walter, J Jones. TE Z Miller K Rackers D Saints.

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#23 2007-08-12 16:06:15

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

Caddy was gone, Williams was there but I like Norwood better than Williams this year just because it sounds like Norwood is going to get most of the carries, while Williams is still splitting carries with Foster.
But I agree, I didn't really like the pick of Norwood either. Thankfully, I won't have to make a decision like that in my real draft because I will already have Jackson, probably Maroney and Thomas jones or Duece as my top 3 RB.


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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#24 2007-08-12 20:36:19

Kevin
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Re: The Opposite

Even if you don't use The Opposite in a real draft, it's fun to do a mock draft with it.  It feels so funky taking Manning in round one!


"It's time to NUT UP, or SHUT UP!"  --  Tallahassee

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#25 2007-08-12 21:15:42

jetskifreak82
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Re: The Opposite

Yeah everyone was laughing at me when I took Manning at the third spot... I felt so dirty and ashamed.


QB: Warner    RB: S. Jackson, B Jacobs, D Ward, J Lewis, Caddy , C. Taylor, Shonn Greene   WR: R Moss, Ochocinco, Holt, Avery, Muhammad    TE: Witten  K: Elam

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